Just came across this powerful paragraph from Mary Oliver's "A Poetry Handbook"
It is appropriate and useful to begin writing poems in a group, class, or workshop. Then, as one becomes more skilled, there is a natural and necessary movement away from the group. The writer now wants less discussion, fewer commentators. The writer now has a much clearer idea of what he or she wants to do—there is not so much need for ideas as there is for application and for self-communing. There will always remain intervals of pleasure and illumination among friends and other poets. But, finally, one realizes that one *may* be ready for the real work. On that day the writer understands that solitude is the necessity, and leaves friends, and workshops, and handbooks, and heads for it, diligently and resolutely.
I felt myself furiously nodding so much throughout all of this! Especially agree about building your own sustainable form of accountability (instead of relying on classes) and using personal experience to then try and answer questions.
Going to be sharing "it's more useful when we’ve butted heads with problems and then seek the answers" in my future newsletter too!
I feel this! I also recently withdrew from a class because I really felt the need to slow down and re-nurture my writing in a way that ignited excitement and curiosity, rather than just productivity! Classes also sometimes take you away from the art/writing you really want to do because of all the assignments and reading, that are interesting, but ultimately may distract or take away your energy. Love the idea of taking a pause and re-evaluating what'll best serve you 🥰
I'm happy to hear you've heeded the call to nourish yourself and your writing, and to fill up your cup with possibility over productivity! I really underestimate how draining classes can be since they're so exciting in the beginning. Hoping your pause leads to lots of fun discoveries and re-entries into your writing!
Exactly! This is so true and so timely, Carolyn, as I just stopped myself spending money I don’t have on a course by an artist I admire, teaching stuff I kind of know already. It was a good experience to actually pull back and think no, I don’t need that. A confidence boost, to think what I really need is a ‘workshop’ with myself, digging deep into what is already brewing. Thanks so much.
Absolutely Julie! And it’s okay to go back to classes after we try on our own and feel blocked. But we first do have to try! Best wishes to you as you self-commune!
I think part of the challenge is making the commitment to yourself. I’m just completing a textiles degree that will have taken me 10 years to do part time. That’s a huge commitment but signing up for the course and paying certainly made sure I kept going at times. Short courses do the same. I’m finding ways to make a similar commitment just to work by myself. Any tips welcome!
I'm a dreamer who now finally want to embark on writing seriously, something I've been dreaming of since I was 10. And what do you know, I was compelled to sign up for classes thinking "I need more knowledge", "I need to learn the way of a writer", "I need to improve my English", "I need to find my voice", "I need to learn what and how to write". Thanks for sharing your tips on when to know if you need a class and when not to, cause in the end, we just need to get down to doing it! So maybe I will finally launch my own Substack instead...:)
What a wonderful dedication to a writing practice! Whether you take a class or launch a Substack, I hope you have fun with it and prioritize your joy 💗
You make a good point about not just taking a class because we think it's the only way we can make art.
I've never taken a proper art class. I wanted to take one last year monthly to meet some other artists. If I ever do take one, I think finding a community would be my main reason.
Community is one of the best reasons to take a class! It does take effort to connect outside of class, especially online ones, to solidify the connections so you're not dependent on that class to exist or have to continue paying for it. I hope you find the right community for you when the time is right!
I feel like you just jumped into my brain for a few hours! I’ve also been contemplating taking some classes from illustrators I admire who are offering workshops in things I do want to improve on, but knowing full well that I just need to commit dedicated time to doing it myself! This was a little kick up the backside to not give into that new year mentality where we have to start loads of new things, especially when they cost money!! 💓
Hi Ro! Absolutely, I have full faith you can make what you want to guiding the ship yourself 💗 and that you’ll seek out the resources when YOU are sure you need them, not when they’re being marketed to you!
the best class I took was an online songwriting workshop which was paid for by the scottish arts council. ended up meeting my mentors and one of my favourite collaborators on there. it was SO WORTH IT. but by and large i don't take classes. it's mainly a money thing, and i'm spending a lot on my album at the moment which to be honest, the whole process is a class in itself!! i'm always learning one way or another, so for me classes are mainly a way to find new connections and community more than anything else.
Bless public arts funding!! Classes really are nice for bringing people with the same interests together, and once you meet them you can continue the relationship and collaboration outside, as you've wisely done :)
“Now I am questioning if I have been pursuing feel-good productivity over devotion to my own creative practice.” There is so much wisdom in that statement! Continuous quality improvement should be pursued in career and personal life; we all look for “nuggets” that might spur innovative thinking. But feel-good productivity is a Siren song that promises much but is more often counterproductive.
“The distraction and the goal can be so similar, nearly identical to the untrained eye, but upon close inspection they don’t hold the same weight.” So much wisdom in THAT statement, too! You must see what’s going on is a form of marketing that would entice a person to lay their money down; an entire industry that seems altruistic but is just the opposite. We all are susceptible by thinking, “Oh this will be the key to my success!” It is the key to success for the presenter.
Art and writing require talent and creativity that even evaded the greats for most of their existence on Earth. And extra degree or certification cannot produce the innate attributes that can make one into a success in the fields of art or writing. There must be a muse, inside, that speaks to the artist or the writer. Classes or programs focusing on the marketing aspect of art and writing may be beneficial, however, but that only goes so far, also. Art and writing provide the self-satisfaction that most of us spend a lifetime searching for in our own far fewer creative pursuits. Be happy in your art and writing; find joy in the journey.
I look at my own profession, as a pharmacist for 45 years; innovation and creativity, not anything near the type needed for careers in art or writing, were a plus during my career. I hated being a dull pharmacist every single day, but I channeled that into being innovative and creative in a career path that rewarded extra degrees or certificates; I chased those two imposters just like you, though I despised the profession and even associating with it, so I stopped.
Those certificates and degrees only were good to promote unfit staff pharmacists into unfit managers. Through risk, innovation and creativity, Lady Luck stepped in and accidently made me world famous, which caused the multi-degreed pharmacists to grind their teeth at what they perceived as the unfairness of it all. I don’t make the rules.
Again, I write too much, not for self-aggrandizement, but for illustration. I was the only speaker invited to this conference with a BS degree; all the other speakers had doctorates!! A beggar at the feast!! LOL!! https://youtu.be/k7wgTTBFZDo?si=mg241YtWJMymezis
"We all are susceptible by thinking, “Oh this will be the key to my success!” It is the key to success for the presenter."—100%, such true words! But oh how many times I fall for it 🤑
What a flex to get that conference invite, haha—goes to show how much credentials don't matter if we are willing to show up and share and find the right people!
I only accepted the invite to the conference because it was all-expence paid, including two nights in a 4-star hotel; plus it made my degree-overladen managers insane with envy!
BUT... back to the point, last week's episode on "This American Life" called "Plan B" is prescient and great advice. I advised my oldest son to focus on majoring in Party Catalyst in college for his Plan B!! He didn't need any encouragement! https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1_ufoHjzFGkwhHwM3E7yzmitm9XCdgrFT
So many great points! For me, I’m culling the very many writing groups/organizations I belong to! Not least of which, is all the money I spent on them, but also all the time! I love the community and I have and do learn a lot from them, but I’ve realized for me right now, the writing is what I need to focus on. What I want to focus on. So I’m really trying to be particular in the groups I keep and how I am involved in them so that they boost my writing and add to it, rather than take away.
Yesss Bridgitte, groups and communities definitely fall into this category too (especially when they're paid and we feel more compelled to attend to "get value")! It does take some trial and error as we find what groups of people we mesh with and at what frequency we'd like to check in with others so that the support and accountability propel us forward.
Hahaha this was my 2023!! I spent 2019 - 2022 taking every class, workshop, course under the sun to help learn the secrets of building a business. I was especially attracted to the ones being taught by people who also left their corporate careers and ones who made 6 figures in 6 months.
Shocker - I still haven’t built a 6 figure business. It took 4 years for me to finally face the face that I was hoping these programs would give me the magic formula but in reality, it’s a lot of hard work and trial and error. And there’s still no guarantee that particular path will be “the one.”
It’s been nice not taking any classes. And like you my new criteria requires that next time I sign up for something, it’s driven by a genuine curiosity to learn. 🫶
Oooh I love hearing your perspective from "the other side" and that you came to that realization pretty quickly (4 years is quick in my book!) There are so many "6 figures in 6 months" type classes and social media posts these days, the irony being that those people are selling and making money from exploiting that very fantasy. I don't doubt that there are a few people who reach those numbers but it's rare for that income to be consistent like the fantasy makes it seem.
Best of luck building a business through consistency, experimentation, and most of all knowing that you believe in what you want to sell :)
As a serial class taker, this really speaks to me. I often hide behind the veil of class taking, which in mind mind equals productivity and progress towards something I might want to work on. In reality, it rarely brings me closer to actually DOING it.
Thanks for writing this. I think a lot of makers substitute consumption — of classes, supplies, or other makers’ content (I see you, Instagram) — for making. Consumption becomes the hobby.
I do find that I produce from classes — I like to have my hand held when I learn! But I often feel like I’m letting fear win when I don’t just do the thing on my own.
oooo I love this take! I watched about six hundred YouTube videos, signed up for Patreon, called my art teacher mom, read every book the library had, and took classes on color theory. One day I realized there wasn't a magic portal with EVEN MORE information than I had. The next step was just practice. Being alone at your desk with new knowledge and years of practice ahead is daunting, but so worth it. I too have vowed off classes for a little while!
Just came across this powerful paragraph from Mary Oliver's "A Poetry Handbook"
It is appropriate and useful to begin writing poems in a group, class, or workshop. Then, as one becomes more skilled, there is a natural and necessary movement away from the group. The writer now wants less discussion, fewer commentators. The writer now has a much clearer idea of what he or she wants to do—there is not so much need for ideas as there is for application and for self-communing. There will always remain intervals of pleasure and illumination among friends and other poets. But, finally, one realizes that one *may* be ready for the real work. On that day the writer understands that solitude is the necessity, and leaves friends, and workshops, and handbooks, and heads for it, diligently and resolutely.
I LOVE THIS PASSAGE! Very on theme 💯 thank you so much for sharing! "Self-communing", what a beautiful way to put it.
I felt myself furiously nodding so much throughout all of this! Especially agree about building your own sustainable form of accountability (instead of relying on classes) and using personal experience to then try and answer questions.
Going to be sharing "it's more useful when we’ve butted heads with problems and then seek the answers" in my future newsletter too!
I can feel your nods from here! Much gratitude to our fruitful conversation for inspiring the post 💛
I feel this! I also recently withdrew from a class because I really felt the need to slow down and re-nurture my writing in a way that ignited excitement and curiosity, rather than just productivity! Classes also sometimes take you away from the art/writing you really want to do because of all the assignments and reading, that are interesting, but ultimately may distract or take away your energy. Love the idea of taking a pause and re-evaluating what'll best serve you 🥰
I'm happy to hear you've heeded the call to nourish yourself and your writing, and to fill up your cup with possibility over productivity! I really underestimate how draining classes can be since they're so exciting in the beginning. Hoping your pause leads to lots of fun discoveries and re-entries into your writing!
Exactly! This is so true and so timely, Carolyn, as I just stopped myself spending money I don’t have on a course by an artist I admire, teaching stuff I kind of know already. It was a good experience to actually pull back and think no, I don’t need that. A confidence boost, to think what I really need is a ‘workshop’ with myself, digging deep into what is already brewing. Thanks so much.
Absolutely Julie! And it’s okay to go back to classes after we try on our own and feel blocked. But we first do have to try! Best wishes to you as you self-commune!
I think part of the challenge is making the commitment to yourself. I’m just completing a textiles degree that will have taken me 10 years to do part time. That’s a huge commitment but signing up for the course and paying certainly made sure I kept going at times. Short courses do the same. I’m finding ways to make a similar commitment just to work by myself. Any tips welcome!
A workshop with myself, digging deep into what's alreaf brewing
I'm a dreamer who now finally want to embark on writing seriously, something I've been dreaming of since I was 10. And what do you know, I was compelled to sign up for classes thinking "I need more knowledge", "I need to learn the way of a writer", "I need to improve my English", "I need to find my voice", "I need to learn what and how to write". Thanks for sharing your tips on when to know if you need a class and when not to, cause in the end, we just need to get down to doing it! So maybe I will finally launch my own Substack instead...:)
What a wonderful dedication to a writing practice! Whether you take a class or launch a Substack, I hope you have fun with it and prioritize your joy 💗
You make a good point about not just taking a class because we think it's the only way we can make art.
I've never taken a proper art class. I wanted to take one last year monthly to meet some other artists. If I ever do take one, I think finding a community would be my main reason.
Community is one of the best reasons to take a class! It does take effort to connect outside of class, especially online ones, to solidify the connections so you're not dependent on that class to exist or have to continue paying for it. I hope you find the right community for you when the time is right!
I feel like you just jumped into my brain for a few hours! I’ve also been contemplating taking some classes from illustrators I admire who are offering workshops in things I do want to improve on, but knowing full well that I just need to commit dedicated time to doing it myself! This was a little kick up the backside to not give into that new year mentality where we have to start loads of new things, especially when they cost money!! 💓
Hi Ro! Absolutely, I have full faith you can make what you want to guiding the ship yourself 💗 and that you’ll seek out the resources when YOU are sure you need them, not when they’re being marketed to you!
the best class I took was an online songwriting workshop which was paid for by the scottish arts council. ended up meeting my mentors and one of my favourite collaborators on there. it was SO WORTH IT. but by and large i don't take classes. it's mainly a money thing, and i'm spending a lot on my album at the moment which to be honest, the whole process is a class in itself!! i'm always learning one way or another, so for me classes are mainly a way to find new connections and community more than anything else.
Bless public arts funding!! Classes really are nice for bringing people with the same interests together, and once you meet them you can continue the relationship and collaboration outside, as you've wisely done :)
“Now I am questioning if I have been pursuing feel-good productivity over devotion to my own creative practice.” There is so much wisdom in that statement! Continuous quality improvement should be pursued in career and personal life; we all look for “nuggets” that might spur innovative thinking. But feel-good productivity is a Siren song that promises much but is more often counterproductive.
“The distraction and the goal can be so similar, nearly identical to the untrained eye, but upon close inspection they don’t hold the same weight.” So much wisdom in THAT statement, too! You must see what’s going on is a form of marketing that would entice a person to lay their money down; an entire industry that seems altruistic but is just the opposite. We all are susceptible by thinking, “Oh this will be the key to my success!” It is the key to success for the presenter.
Art and writing require talent and creativity that even evaded the greats for most of their existence on Earth. And extra degree or certification cannot produce the innate attributes that can make one into a success in the fields of art or writing. There must be a muse, inside, that speaks to the artist or the writer. Classes or programs focusing on the marketing aspect of art and writing may be beneficial, however, but that only goes so far, also. Art and writing provide the self-satisfaction that most of us spend a lifetime searching for in our own far fewer creative pursuits. Be happy in your art and writing; find joy in the journey.
I look at my own profession, as a pharmacist for 45 years; innovation and creativity, not anything near the type needed for careers in art or writing, were a plus during my career. I hated being a dull pharmacist every single day, but I channeled that into being innovative and creative in a career path that rewarded extra degrees or certificates; I chased those two imposters just like you, though I despised the profession and even associating with it, so I stopped.
Those certificates and degrees only were good to promote unfit staff pharmacists into unfit managers. Through risk, innovation and creativity, Lady Luck stepped in and accidently made me world famous, which caused the multi-degreed pharmacists to grind their teeth at what they perceived as the unfairness of it all. I don’t make the rules.
Again, I write too much, not for self-aggrandizement, but for illustration. I was the only speaker invited to this conference with a BS degree; all the other speakers had doctorates!! A beggar at the feast!! LOL!! https://youtu.be/k7wgTTBFZDo?si=mg241YtWJMymezis
"We all are susceptible by thinking, “Oh this will be the key to my success!” It is the key to success for the presenter."—100%, such true words! But oh how many times I fall for it 🤑
What a flex to get that conference invite, haha—goes to show how much credentials don't matter if we are willing to show up and share and find the right people!
I only accepted the invite to the conference because it was all-expence paid, including two nights in a 4-star hotel; plus it made my degree-overladen managers insane with envy!
BUT... back to the point, last week's episode on "This American Life" called "Plan B" is prescient and great advice. I advised my oldest son to focus on majoring in Party Catalyst in college for his Plan B!! He didn't need any encouragement! https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1_ufoHjzFGkwhHwM3E7yzmitm9XCdgrFT
So many great points! For me, I’m culling the very many writing groups/organizations I belong to! Not least of which, is all the money I spent on them, but also all the time! I love the community and I have and do learn a lot from them, but I’ve realized for me right now, the writing is what I need to focus on. What I want to focus on. So I’m really trying to be particular in the groups I keep and how I am involved in them so that they boost my writing and add to it, rather than take away.
Yesss Bridgitte, groups and communities definitely fall into this category too (especially when they're paid and we feel more compelled to attend to "get value")! It does take some trial and error as we find what groups of people we mesh with and at what frequency we'd like to check in with others so that the support and accountability propel us forward.
Hahaha this was my 2023!! I spent 2019 - 2022 taking every class, workshop, course under the sun to help learn the secrets of building a business. I was especially attracted to the ones being taught by people who also left their corporate careers and ones who made 6 figures in 6 months.
Shocker - I still haven’t built a 6 figure business. It took 4 years for me to finally face the face that I was hoping these programs would give me the magic formula but in reality, it’s a lot of hard work and trial and error. And there’s still no guarantee that particular path will be “the one.”
It’s been nice not taking any classes. And like you my new criteria requires that next time I sign up for something, it’s driven by a genuine curiosity to learn. 🫶
Oooh I love hearing your perspective from "the other side" and that you came to that realization pretty quickly (4 years is quick in my book!) There are so many "6 figures in 6 months" type classes and social media posts these days, the irony being that those people are selling and making money from exploiting that very fantasy. I don't doubt that there are a few people who reach those numbers but it's rare for that income to be consistent like the fantasy makes it seem.
Best of luck building a business through consistency, experimentation, and most of all knowing that you believe in what you want to sell :)
As a serial class taker, this really speaks to me. I often hide behind the veil of class taking, which in mind mind equals productivity and progress towards something I might want to work on. In reality, it rarely brings me closer to actually DOING it.
You nailed it with the "veil of class taking" Anna! Have totally been there. What are some things you want to work on this year?
Too late, already signed up 😅
Never too late! But judging from your prolific output I think you will be just fine 😉
Thanks for writing this. I think a lot of makers substitute consumption — of classes, supplies, or other makers’ content (I see you, Instagram) — for making. Consumption becomes the hobby.
I do find that I produce from classes — I like to have my hand held when I learn! But I often feel like I’m letting fear win when I don’t just do the thing on my own.
oooo I love this take! I watched about six hundred YouTube videos, signed up for Patreon, called my art teacher mom, read every book the library had, and took classes on color theory. One day I realized there wasn't a magic portal with EVEN MORE information than I had. The next step was just practice. Being alone at your desk with new knowledge and years of practice ahead is daunting, but so worth it. I too have vowed off classes for a little while!
I read this story today, out of M.I.T. about a collaboration of science and art...I thought it may be of interest: https://news.mit.edu/2024/turning-science-history-comic-adventure-0111
"In Scheffler’s talk, he showed examples throughout history of scientists using art and artists using science."